Grid-Iron american football game language selector
Language
ČeštinaDanskDeutsch
EnglishEspañolEspañol (Latinoamérica)
FrançaisItalianoMagyar
NederlandsPolskiPortuguês (Brasil)
RomânăSlovenčinaSlovenščina
SrpskiSuomiБългарски
РусскийУкраїнська 
Register
Login
20 Stamina Bug?
 
hoospack
Posts: 775
Joined: 2012-10-22
I.1
Offline
Posted on 2020-06-25 20:03:02
In my 8 years here at GI, I have never heard of this bug until someone mentioned it to me today in a private message chat about a possible NT player. Is this a real thing? If so, what is the 20 Stamina bug??
  
bghandras
Posts: 841
Posted on 2020-06-25 20:28:17
What i can see is that sometimes a player with stamina20 has an absurd low initial form for the given game, which then elevates to normal level as the game progresses. I have no hard evidence whether it is a display thing or real, but based on some results i suspect it is for real and could account for some losses.
On the basis of rather be safe than sorry, i personally do not touch stamina 20 players. (Also, it is not that hard to avoid them, so the cost of avoidance is low.)
  
hoospack
Posts: 775
Joined: 2012-10-22
I.1
Offline
Posted on 2020-06-25 20:41:15
bghandras wrote:

What i can see is that sometimes a player with stamina20 has an absurd low initial form for the given game, which then elevates to normal level as the game progresses. I have no hard evidence whether it is a display thing or real, but based on some results i suspect it is for real and could account for some losses.
On the basis of rather be safe than sorry, i personally do not touch stamina 20 players. (Also, it is not that hard to avoid them, so the cost of avoidance is low.)



Crap. I just bought several players with 20 stamina and sold off half my team.

Bad time to find out about this possible bug.
  
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)simpathiaGI Supporter
Posts: 1009
Joined: 2015-04-29
II.2
Offline
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)
Posted on 2020-06-25 21:25:36
I had a stamina 20 player on my team last season (Libor Svoboda, I played division II.3, you can check out his performance for yourself if you want).
I was fully aware of the bug, even when I bought him, but he performed well enough to keep him.

What happened was that about half the games he started with 5 stars and ended with 5 stars, as you would expect with 20 stamina. The other half of the games he would start with 5 stars and end with 4 stars, as if he would have a stamina of below 10.
This 50/50 behaviour could be related to whether the consistency rng came up with a positive or a negative number. Although he would score the same for both positions I played him on and I was under the impression that if a player plays two positions the consistence dice is rolled for both positions independently.
Anyway, half the time he was an absolute stud, half the time he was merely ok. And that is by looking at his game ratings and I don't know what they are worth. In summary I never saw a reason to get rid of him.
Since many players avoid stamina 20 players like the plague I assume you got yours cheaply, so you might have gotten a great deal...
  


hoospack
Posts: 775
Joined: 2012-10-22
I.1
Offline
Posted on 2020-06-25 22:06:56
simpathia wrote:

I had a stamina 20 player on my team last season (Libor Svoboda, I played division II.3, you can check out his performance for yourself if you want).
I was fully aware of the bug, even when I bought him, but he performed well enough to keep him.

What happened was that about half the games he started with 5 stars and ended with 5 stars, as you would expect with 20 stamina. The other half of the games he would start with 5 stars and end with 4 stars, as if he would have a stamina of below 10.
This 50/50 behaviour could be related to whether the consistency rng came up with a positive or a negative number. Although he would score the same for both positions I played him on and I was under the impression that if a player plays two positions the consistence dice is rolled for both positions independently.
Anyway, half the time he was an absolute stud, half the time he was merely ok. And that is by looking at his game ratings and I don't know what they are worth. In summary I never saw a reason to get rid of him.
Since many players avoid stamina 20 players like the plague I assume you got yours cheaply, so you might have gotten a great deal...



I actually bought Libor Svoboda, but sold him a week after purchasing him because I found a better replacement. It just so happens the replacement also had 20 Stamina. hahaha

Thanks for this feedback. I won't be too concerned, but I will watch it closely.
  
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)simpathiaGI Supporter
Posts: 1009
Joined: 2015-04-29
II.2
Offline
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)
Posted on 2020-06-25 23:34:12
Hahaha so you know the guy. That's funny

Yeah, I could be wrong of course but it seems likely to me that this isn't a truly terrible bug.
This bug has been around for ages. When I joined 5 years ago it was already an old bug. And I know that this game hasn't gotten a lot of love from the developers lately, but they did do some work on it in the 5 years that I've been playing, so I'm pretty convinced that if this would be a major bug they would have fixed it. Or maybe it was a truly terrible bug at first, but they sort of fixed it (sort of, but not perfectly) and after that they figured it wasn't perfect but at least good enough....
I run a team of software developers. It's probably what I would have done
  


Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)lvessGI Supporter
Posts: 791
Joined: 2014-02-16
II.1
Offline
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)
Posted on 2020-06-26 1:36:15
I've always thought that the impact of the bug depended on which position(s) it involved. Having it occur at QB, RB, FB, WE, TE, or CB is likely worse than at OL, DL, LB, SF. Basically, the large independent role a player has on the game the bigger the impact.
  
cflames3412
Posts: 7366
Posted on 2020-06-26 2:24:46
20 stam is a dealbreaker stay away
  
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)simpathiaGI Supporter
Posts: 1009
Joined: 2015-04-29
II.2
Offline
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)
Posted on 2020-06-26 7:47:18
lvess wrote:

I've always thought that the impact of the bug depended on which position(s) it involved. Having it occur at QB, RB, FB, WE, TE, or CB is likely worse than at OL, DL, LB, SF. Basically, the large independent role a player has on the game the bigger the impact.



Yeah that would make sense. I mean the data that I shared suggests that a stamina 20 guy plays half his matches as a stamina 20 guy and half his matches as a stamina 1 guy (or maybe not 1, but at least below 10). That is not something I would want on my QB, MLB or S. For other positions it doesn't seem like the end of the world to me though.

I try to compare it with a player that has low consistency. Seems to me that low consistency is worse than stamina20, because when a low consistency player gets a negative rng roll he plays worse the whole game in stead of only half the game. So that would make stamina20 comparable to consistency10 I guess? Or maybe consistency 5? Something like that. Not ideal, but it doesn't make the guy unplayable either.

When I first heard of the stamina20 bug it was floating around the forums without any supporting evidence. It had all the hallmarks of everybody just parroting each other without anybody really knowing what's up, and in my mind any unsubstantiated claim is potentially a competitive advantage. The more inaccurate the claim and the more widely it is believed, the greater the opportunity to get a competitive advantage out of it. A wise man once told me: "Don't be a follower. Make your own path." (That was hoospack, yesterday). So I took a flyer on a cheap stamina20 OL/DL player and as far as I can tell from the data that wasn't a bad decision.

Does anybody have other examples of stamina20 players? A skill position player maybe?
  


hoospack
Posts: 775
Joined: 2012-10-22
I.1
Offline
Posted on 2020-06-26 8:08:49
simpathia wrote:

lvess wrote:

I've always thought that the impact of the bug depended on which position(s) it involved. Having it occur at QB, RB, FB, WE, TE, or CB is likely worse than at OL, DL, LB, SF. Basically, the large independent role a player has on the game the bigger the impact.



Yeah that would make sense. I mean the data that I shared suggests that a stamina 20 guy plays half his matches as a stamina 20 guy and half his matches as a stamina 1 guy (or maybe not 1, but at least below 10). That is not something I would want on my QB, MLB or S. For other positions it doesn't seem like the end of the world to me though.

I try to compare it with a player that has low consistency. Seems to me that low consistency is worse than stamina20, because when a low consistency player gets a negative rng roll he plays worse the whole game in stead of only half the game. So that would make stamina20 comparable to consistency10 I guess? Or maybe consistency 5? Something like that. Not ideal, but it doesn't make the guy unplayable either.

When I first heard of the stamina20 bug it was floating around the forums without any supporting evidence. It had all the hallmarks of everybody just parroting each other without anybody really knowing what's up, and in my mind any unsubstantiated claim is potentially a competitive advantage. The more inaccurate the claim and the more widely it is believed, the greater the opportunity to get a competitive advantage out of it. A wise man once told me: "Don't be a follower. Make your own path." (That was hoospack, yesterday). So I took a flyer on a cheap stamina20 OL/DL player and as far as I can tell from the data that wasn't a bad decision.

Does anybody have other examples of stamina20 players? A skill position player maybe?



Well my team now has several Stamina 20 players. To make matters more interesting, all of these players are trained to play both Offense and Defense. I will be tracking their performance closely. So far, there has not been a noticeable drop off from the beginning rating to the end of match rating or performance.

I tried to chat with one of the NT managers about one of these players who have great skills (18/19+ for all main skills). He was the one who refused to put him on the NT because of the 20 Stamina bug. So far this particular player has been solid. Seems like a waste of a perfectly good player if this "bug" isn't a really big impact.

I will be happy to test the waters and potentially reap the benefits!
  
 
Last posts
2024-04-19 19:46
Nationalmannschaft
Author:Samuelcrel
2024-04-19 19:24
Reprezentacja Polski
Author:frozi
2024-04-19 15:09
Verkaufsthread
Author:Baphomet
2024-04-19 15:02
Ligathread
Author:Baphomet
2024-04-19 14:49
Ligathread
Author:liberalmente
2024-04-18 19:23
Pokalthread
Author:TheGamingMo
2024-04-18 15:59
Ligathread
Author:Baphomet